Restaurant Menu Substitutions

TastyReuben

Nosh 'n' Splosh
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I spoke with my niece today (via text), and I thought I'd relay some of what we talked about, to get a few opinions here.

The scenario: she was eating breakfast in a resort hotel restaurant. She's not traveling, it's just in her neighborhood and serves the public and hotel guests.

Anyhoo, the menu had set meals or plates, so no a la carte or even sides on offers. Simplifying things a bit, one plate was something like eggs with potatoes and toast, and another plate was something along the lines of French toast with bacon, and maybe a third was a plain omelette with a bit of fresh fruit on the side.

Well, my niece wanted the French toast from this plate, and the potatoes from that plate, so she asked for a substitution, which they refused, even after she offered to pay any difference in cost.

She was a bit miffed and texted me about it, and I gently came down on the side of the restaurant, and her feeling, being the diner/customer, was that the potatoes are already back there, "just put some on my French toast plate" and keep the bacon.

Having never worked in a restaurant, my assumption is that inventories, especially in a place that doesn't offer items a la carte or as a side, is kept pretty close to what they think they'll sell for the day, and if this server takes an order of potatoes for this table, and that server does the same for their table, pretty soon, you've got more eggs than potatoes, and your whole plan for the day is wrecked.

After that long-winded story, my first question is to the professionals on the site (garlichead, Rocklobster, Windigo, PabloLerntKochen, and apologies to anyone else I forgot): how do you feel about customers who want to substitute this for that?

My next questions is for everyone who dines out: do you ever ask for substitutions, or do you prefer to just order something as-is? If you do like to customize things a bit, do you expect to have a "customer is always right" experience, or are you more understanding if the restaurant says no?

I do understand there's a difference between the situation I described above, where all the meals were predetermined versus a place where there are plenty of individual items on offer versus a more "chef-driven" establishment where the chef has worked to create a particular dish, and maybe you want to dismantle it a bit.

I'll get started by answering my own question as a diner: as someone who's not particularly fussy over restaurant food (I'm just happy to be eating out), once I see something I like, I order it as it's listed, and that's that. My wife will ask about changing things around a little about half the time.
 
First, I can see how you would see substitutions they way you do, as I've gotten to know your personality.

As for my view, if a request is reasonable, then a restaurant should accommodate the diner. I rarely ask for substitutions, but I do occasionally. If the server says "No," there better be a reason other than "We don't do that." I can always adopt my own policy of "Your tip may be a little light and I'm not coming back."

CD
 
Good question TR. Personally and historically I generally don't ask for substitutions especially if it's from a restaurant where I'm critiquing the chef trying to get into their head on how they combine ingredients of an entree which when you substitute for other aspects, changes what their actually trying to accomplish. As chefs this is what we do, or should do imo. Fast food, I rarely eat and I'm not really fussy, it's just to fill a caloric need with a food that will stay down, which is getting harder and harder to find lol.

As a chef I'm fine with substitutions, omissions or anything I have on hand that may make a better dinning experience for that particular person if it's at all possible in that moment of time, and sometimes you can't but offer alternatives. This rarely happens btw, although we do have a few regulars that we know want us to make special, just for them.......kinda funny really.
 
Good question TR. Personally and historically I generally don't ask for substitutions especially if it's from a restaurant where I'm critiquing the chef trying to get into their head on how they combine ingredients of an entree which when you substitute for other aspects, changes what their actually trying to accomplish. As chefs this is what we do, or should do imo. Fast food, I rarely eat and I'm not really fussy, it's just to fill a caloric need with a food that will stay down, which is getting harder and harder to find lol.

As a chef I'm fine with substitutions, omissions or anything I have on hand that may make a better dinning experience for that particular person if it's at all possible in that moment of time, and sometimes you can't but offer alternatives. This rarely happens btw, although we do have a few regulars that we know want us to make special, just for them.......kinda funny really.

There are some accommodations that a kitchen has to be ready to make -- or have an EpiPen ready. Other than that, as you said, substitutions are a matter of making a diner's experience better -- if it's reasonable. For example, if I really liked the description of a menu item, but it had grilled eggplant on the side, I'd not hesitate to ask if they could grill some other vegetable for mine. I think that is reasonable. Chances are they will have other veggies in the kitchen.

My mom has one very serious dietary restriction, and it is a PITA. Restaurants almost always accommodate her, although she gets some weird looks from some waiters. Years ago, we were at one of the best restaurants in Dallas, with well known chef, Dean Fearing, and my mom made her normal dietary restriction request, and the waiter went to the kitchen, and a few minutes later, Chef Fearing came out and asked her specific questions about her request, and listened carefully to her response, and told her he would would take care of it. He customized her entree to meet her needs, and she said it was amazing.

Dean Fearing - Wikipedia

CD
 
There are some accommodations that a kitchen has to be ready to make -- or have an EpiPen ready. Other than that, as you said, substitutions are a matter of making a diner's experience better -- if it's reasonable. For example, if I really liked the description of a menu item, but it had grilled eggplant on the side, I'd not hesitate to ask if they could grill some other vegetable for mine. I think that is reasonable. Chances are they will have other veggies in the kitchen.

My mom has one very serious dietary restriction, and it is a PITA. Restaurants almost always accommodate her, although she gets some weird looks from some waiters. Years ago, we were at one of the best restaurants in Dallas, with well known chef, Dean Fearing, and my mom made her normal dietary restriction request, and the waiter went to the kitchen, and a few minutes later, Chef Fearing came out and asked her specific questions about her request, and listened carefully to her response, and told her he would would take care of it. He customized her entree to meet her needs, and she said it was amazing.

Dean Fearing - Wikipedia

CD
I baked a no flour chocolate cake for a dessert option once for a customer where I had time over their meal, so yeah, whatever you can do to make a better dinning experience is important in my books. Dean did the right thing by going out and talking with your Mom. sometimes it vital to talk with the customer directly as to not get the wrong information and this is more common that you think. I've done the same thing many times as do other chefs I know. Also it depends on the restaurant for substitutions. Sometimes changing things up can be problematic for some chefs for sure, especially it it's a lot of processed and frozen foods. Of course there's chefs with big ego's that will defy anyone that dares change their good.
 
We did have a restaurant chef come out and talk to my wife once in Edinburgh.

This was back in the '90's, and we were on a break. We didn't know it at the time, but her appendix was slowly going bad, and it would leak out fluid and cause her to feel very ill.

We'd gone to a little Italian place, nothing fancy but not a chain, and nothing on the menu sounded good to her, so she asked the waiter for a recommendation of something plain, and the chef came out, sat at the table with us, and worked out a pasta dish that was flavorful, but not too much so, and not too heavy.
 
I always ask for hash browns or grits over breakfast potatoes (fried cubes) because they are nearly always under or over cooked and, in most places, have a funky taste to me because of whatever oil or grease they use to cook them. I've never had a place tell me no or charge me as long as they have the hash browns of grits available.

And I'll occasionally ask for onion rings instead of fries, for which there is usually an upcharge.
 
I would have thought that, for breakfast dishes, subbing one item for another is not a big deal. I mean, changing breakfast potatoes for French toast, for example, is not exactly complicated. If it were Eggs Benedict or an omelette Arnold Bennet, then the situation would be different.
Most professionals I know are only too happy to accommodate their dishes to suit the clients ´tastes and, more important, dietary /allergy requirements. The worst case scenario in a restaurant must be seeing a client going into anaphylactic shock because of the shrimp...:hyper:
A couple of years ago, I was giving a Basic Indian Food course at a local restaurant. I´d barely started when one of the participants said " Are you going to use chile peppers? Because I don´t like spicy food. Oh, and I´m also allergic to wheat products and I don´t do dairy"
:eek::eek:. The only thing I could think of was to say: " Well, ok, but Indian food is almost always spicy. Are you sure you´ve signed up for the right course?"
 
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