Vegan, Paleo, what?

DIna00

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Can someone explain some of these new diet styles out there, like vegan, paleo, etc?

I can't seem to wrap my head around them for whatever reason. I understand vegetarian, as I was one for a while, but I don't understand some of these new ones and what they eat and don't eat, and why not.

Do people do them solely for health, or is it more for ethical, moral reasons?
 
There is nothing new about being vegan. It is simply vegetarian without dairy, eggs, honey (or any other animal, insect, fish, mammal etc products, excretement or anything else, so no crushed up insect shells or insect excretement such as shellac) involved in the diet. No use of skin, bones, ground up fish bones to filter wine, etc in your food or life style, no use of animal fat (tallow) to make soap etc.

It can be for health, ethical or moral and even religious reasons.

A link on this site to food that vegetarians should avoid
www.cookingbites.com/threads/foods-drinks-vegetarians-should-avoid.987/

A link on this site do foods vegans should avoid
Hum, can't find it at the moment but the one above without dairy, honey and eggs is an obvious start!
Sadly if you start to look at ingredients lists you will find dairy in almost everything from bread to margarine to well everything! Just look at ingredients and see how often butter, skimmed milk powder, whey (protein) powder, buttermilk, lactose, lactate, steryol lactate, caesian, yogurt, etc creeps into for manufacturing!
 
SatNavSaysStraightOn has given you a very good explanation of the different diets. The link should also help you understand the kinds of foods that go along with the diets. As for why people choose to go with such lifestyles, for most of the people I know it is mainly for religious reasons and a hand full of them is for health reasons; things like trying to loose weight and keeping fit.
These are hard lifestyles to maintain especially if you don't have a course behind joining them but they are also very doable.
 
I know someone who lost a lot of weight by going paleo. It is a lifestyle choice, not just a temporary diet, but basically you try to eat only natural foods that would have been available to our ancestors in the paleolithic era. It is essentially good for health as well as for keeping weight down. Meat, vegetables, berries and other natural produce form the basis of a paleo diet.
 
It can be for health, ethical or moral and even religious reasons.

What would some of the reasons be? I can understand humane reasons for not killing an animal, but why not even to the products, like honey, milk or eggs? Maybe that's the part I'm having trouble grasping.

Paleo I also still don't understand. I've heard it explained as eating the foods of our ancestors. But our ancestors didn't have supermarkets with produce available in every season, meat and nuts did not go through a processing facility, etc. For example, would you not eat oranges on a paleo diet because they are flown in from other climates, etc.?

Really I believe these diets are very healthy as I see many healthy people on them, and I myself am always open to trying new things too. Yet I find it hard to start one because I'm not sure what not to eat and why!
 
why not even to the products, like honey, milk or eggs?
exploitation of animals, insects, egg layers.

Look up what is done to calves to ensure a good milk production from cow's. The antibiotics and hormones routinely fed to cows to keep them milking longer. What happens to cows when they no longer produce enough milk to be economical? Dairy cows are not eaten by humans when they are killed. That is 'beef' cows only. Cows have a natural age of 25 years. Dairy cows that are solely for milking are usually slaughtered at 4-5 years old because they no longer produce enough milk (not a case of not producing any milk) to be worthwhile keeping.

Hens don't fair much better. their natural lifespan is around 7-10 years, yet they only lay eggs for 2-3 years at best. if they don't lay enough eggs.... and they are usually killed at around 15 months old when they no longer produce enough eggs. the conditions the are kept in can often be less than ideal. Free range is not always free range and battery eggs are exactly that - a caged hen for all of its life and that is only the female chickens. Males are killed when they are 2-3 days old and then fed into the various food chains for dogs, cats, snakes or their bodies just burnt. Male chicks are not considered suitable for human eating purposes. Female chickens only for that and they are selectively breed to grow really fast and are usually killed when they are 5-6 weeks old! And sadly free range does not always mean free range as in outside able to feed naturally and roam freely - it simply means that they are not caged. they can still be in very crowded, unsanitary conditions (hence routinely fed antibiotics) and often not even in the open air. Free range often means in large sheds of upto 16,000 birds at any one time! I could go on about debeaking and aggressive behaviour at egg laying time... but I won't, it is too depressing.

Mass production of honey is another issue entirely. Honey is removed way too often to support the hives naturally.
Insects are bred in their millions to produce food and clothing dyes, their secretions are used for glossy coatings of sweets, you know that polished crunchy look some sweets have? Shellac...
Silk moths are boiled alive to obtain the individual strands of silk because it is the only way of unravelling it without it breaking.
As for the plucking of down from live birds such as the eider...
Rabbits don't fair any better - angora rabbits are pluck alive repeatedly for their fur to make angora wool. It makes them bleed....

Those are just the moral reasons.

Health wise - humans never evolved to consume milk based products from any source other than humans and only for a certain age span, It is one of the reasons many people have an intolerance to lactose and some of us an allergy to all dairy.
 
Thanks for that explanation SatNavSaysStraight on. That makes a lot of sense to me. So to clarify further - if the product were from an all natural source, like from your own farm for example, would vegan then eat honey, eggs?
 
Thanks for that explanation SatNavSaysStraight on. That makes a lot of sense to me. So to clarify further - if the product were from an all natural source, like from your own farm for example, would vegan then eat honey, eggs?
Being vegan by definition excludes honey and eggs, which is one of the reasons that I don't claim to be vegan (unless eating out). I usually say something like vegan plus eggs... because I do eat eggs from my landlady's ducks which have 1/2 acre of land for 2 ducks, 2 ponds and 1 stream and come and go as they please. They are happy, well fed and stress free and if they are laying eggs then I am happy to eat the eggs (I'm currently dog and duck sitting whilst my landlady and partner are on holiday for 5 weeks). They are fed twice a day (mostly to bribe them to going into the duck house for safety at night - we live rurally and foxes will kill them if they can) and love to see me and get under my feet. These are happy ducks - but their wings were clipped to they can not fly, which saddens me. However there is nothing I can do about that now, I can only ensure I get them I into the duck house at night so they are safe from predators!

Would another vegan eat eggs from their own hens or ducks? A better question would be why would they have the hens/ducks in the first place? They are more likely to be rescue hens/ducks (it does happen) and simply living out their natural lives in 'comfort'. A true vegan would not eat the eggs the hens/ducks may or may not lay but leave the hens/ducks to sit on the eggs. They would also ensure that there was a cockerel in the flock as well. As for honey, well I would imaging they would only have the hives to ensure good pollination of plants on the farm and would leave the honey for the bees to be honest.

It is a difficult one to answer because every vegan has a different reason for being vegan but mostly it is over animal welfare and the way humans exploit them.

Am I a true vegan - the answer is no, I am not. I eat eggs, (and very occasionally honey), so I am not really a vegan, I am vegetarian minus dairy products. It is easier to say I am vegan plus eggs!
 
So I'm getting the sense vegan is similar to vegetarian, but more for humane reasons revolving around not taking advantage of animals in anyway.

Paleo is eating our ancestors' food... still not sure on that one and what really defines our ancestors' food.

Then I have heard of primal and caveman too, maybe those are like Paleo?
 
Yes, vegan is basically a stricter version of vegetarian. It's the next step if that makes any sense.

Then there is fruitarian but IMO that is really pushing it...

And there is also Raw which does not rearly have to be vegan but usually is*. Raw is basically where nothing is cooked or taken above something like 125F. My brother-in-law follows a raw diet to help control his type 1 diabetes which it had been very successful in doing so for him and as a result some aspects of raw have found their way into our diet as well, simply because I like the products, nothing more!

Paleo, I know nothing about.

*some people following raw diets will eat dehydrated meat (jerky) and uncooked fish (similar to sushi) so this is not as bad as it sounds.
 
Humans evolved to be omnivores - we have neither the dentition nor the digestive system to be purely vegetarian [or purely carnivorous] without a lot of assistance. The 'food of our ancestors' is [and was] what ever we could find , no noble [mythical] sentiments to cloud the issue please. The 'Not killing things' argument doesn't really work because all you are doing is saying I don't like killing things that look cute, moo baa,or grunt. You are still killing plants - we are too far up the food chain for photosynthesis, for us to live something must die end of story. If you want to stand by the principal of not killing anything at all you will starve, again end of story. The ill informed vegetarian [and sorry but there are many] feels proud of their not eating meat, just vegetables and they can salve their conscience with thinking 'it doesn't matter it was only a [ living breathing reproducing] plant. As for RAW [basically uncooked food] then just why.
Milk and dairy products are not a 100% diet but they do provide vitamins. I am all for ethical farming methods however in the wild hens etc might not do as well as many think - they can live for years but in the real world most would be taken by predators much earlier. Cockerels do fight for example [this is NOT an advert for cockfighting] and any injury would mean a slow death.
If you want to be vegan/vegetarian or anything else then that is fine but do so understanding the true facts and make an informed decision - many do not.
This is no comment on either anyone here or vegetarianism in general but I do find that there are quite a few people who 'take up the mantle' do it for very questionable reasons and the result is a lot of very poor information and often biased views.
 
Can someone explain some of these new diet styles out there, like vegan, paleo, etc?

I can't seem to wrap my head around them for whatever reason. I understand vegetarian, as I was one for a while, but I don't understand some of these new ones and what they eat and don't eat, and why not.

Do people do them solely for health, or is it more for ethical, moral reasons?
Well I am vegan for both health and moral reasons, and Ive been this way for over 3 years without any health problems what so ever. Being vegan just means that you don't eat any animals or animal bi-products.
 
Humans evolved to be omnivores - we have neither the dentition nor the digestive system to be purely vegetarian [or purely carnivorous] without a lot of assistance. The 'food of our ancestors' is [and was] what ever we could find , no noble [mythical] sentiments to cloud the issue please. The 'Not killing things' argument doesn't really work because all you are doing is saying I don't like killing things that look cute, moo baa,or grunt. You are still killing plants - we are too far up the food chain for photosynthesis, for us to live something must die end of story. If you want to stand by the principal of not killing anything at all you will starve, again end of story. The ill informed vegetarian [and sorry but there are many] feels proud of their not eating meat, just vegetables and they can salve their conscience with thinking 'it doesn't matter it was only a [ living breathing reproducing] plant. As for RAW [basically uncooked food] then just why.
Milk and dairy products are not a 100% diet but they do provide vitamins. I am all for ethical farming methods however in the wild hens etc might not do as well as many think - they can live for years but in the real world most would be taken by predators much earlier. Cockerels do fight for example [this is NOT an advert for cockfighting] and any injury would mean a slow death.
If you want to be vegan/vegetarian or anything else then that is fine but do so understanding the true facts and make an informed decision - many do not.
This is no comment on either anyone here or vegetarianism in general but I do find that there are quite a few people who 'take up the mantle' do it for very questionable reasons and the result is a lot of very poor information and often biased views.
I eat plants but every plant doesn't have to die. Today I picked tomatoes off my plant and guess what the plant is still alive. Plants don't bleed and are the best source of vitamins period. This diet works for me and most people that apply it, now I will say that there is a wrong way to eat vegan foods. The best is to load up on raw foods, but I do eat my fare share of cooked foods as well.
 
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