Pizza Places, What is Your Measuring Stick?

MypinchofItaly

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For me a good pizza has a 'before during and after eating'.
Before: a glance, it must already look good to me just looking at it. If then cooked in a wood oven, I sit down and have already ordered one.
During: the basic ingredients: dough, and then crust, possibly high, tomato sauce and mozzarella. These are fundamental.
The ingredients 'extra' if I don't like them, I can always remove them with a fork.
After: if I digest it well and I don't drink rivers of water, then for me that is a good pizza.
 

Windigo

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For me, Margharita pizza is the gold standard to determine the Italian from the American or other pizza baker.

If an Italian (my favorite) they use buffalo mozzarella, tomato sauce and fresh basil. End of. The best too I think. Usually a thin crust with air bubbles.

If American they usually use cow's milk mozzarella, which is blander and stringier, and often mix it with another cheese, use tomato sauce and for some reason dried oregano. It can be OK at times, but I only eat it when offered. Usually has a thin solid crust.

If other, Margharita can be anything with cheese and tomatoes. Not worth it for me. Can also have a thick carboard like dough.
 

medtran49

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For me, Margharita pizza is the gold standard to determine the Italian from the American or other pizza baker.

If an Italian (my favorite) they use buffalo mozzarella, tomato sauce and fresh basil. End of. The best too I think. Usually a thin crust with air bubbles.

If American they usually use cow's milk mozzarella, which is blander and stringier, and often mix it with another cheese, use tomato sauce and for some reason dried oregano. It can be OK at times, but I only eat it when offered. Usually has a thin solid crust.

If other, Margharita can be anything with cheese and tomatoes. Not worth it for me. Can also have a thick carboard like dough.

I'm not sure where you're getting pizza in the U.S.A., but no place I know uses oregano on a Margherita and that's what I order nearly every time we go for pizza. Some places do use sauce, but most use thinly sliced tomatoes. Fresh basil is used in nearly all places, though some use dried. Fresh cow's milk moz is most often used, though some do use processed moz. Buffalo moz is much more expensive and not available in quantity for pizza joints to use.
 

TastyReuben

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It's also important to note that comparing American pizza to Italian pizza is really an exercise in frustration.

American pizza is not Italian pizza, nor is it necessarily trying to be, even if they're using similar/same ingredients, techniques, and names. American pizza has about as much in common with its Italian (fifth) cousin (twice removed) as Chinese-American food (General Tso's Chicken) has in common with native Chinese cuisine.

Inspired by, and related to, but vastly different. And that's ok.
 

Windigo

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I'm not sure where you're getting pizza in the U.S.A., but no place I know uses oregano on a Margherita and that's what I order nearly every time we go for pizza. Some places do use sauce, but most use thinly sliced tomatoes. Fresh basil is used in nearly all places, though some use dried. Fresh cow's milk moz is most often used, though some do use processed moz. Buffalo moz is much more expensive and not available in quantity for pizza joints to use.
Well probably that's because I don't live in the USA but we have Domino's etc as well as Italian places. I live in Europe, as you can see near my avatar.

Domino's for example here uses oregano and cows milk mozzarella plus a mix of cheeses.
 

CraigC

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Don't order from chain pizza places. Probably would order from Pizza Hut if they brought back the Priazzo.
 

medtran49

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Well probably that's because I don't live in the USA but we have Domino's etc as well as Italian places. I live in Europe, as you can see near my avatar.

Domino's for example here uses oregano and cows milk mozzarella plus a mix of cheeses.
I realized you were in the Netherlands. YOU made a review of American pizza, implying that you have had American pizza, which you haven't ever actually had per the above quote.

Domino's is a chain, cheap, IMO junk pizza place and I would NEVER eat there. And, just so you know, the menu at chains overseas is changed to reflect the market and can bear little to no resemblance to the menu in America. You really shouldn't make broad/bad characterizations of a country's food based on a place like that, especially when you've never actually eaten food in America.

I've actually had pizza quite a few times in Italy and have been there 3 times. There are places here that make comparable pizza, but they certainly aren't places like Domino's.
 
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Windigo

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I realized you were in the Netherlands. YOU made a review of American pizza, implying that you have had American pizza, which you haven't ever actually had per the above quote.

Domino's is a chain, cheap, IMO junk pizza place and I would NEVER eat there. And, just so you know, the menu at chains overseas is changed to reflect the market and can bear little to no resemblance to the menu in America. You really shouldn't make broad/bad characterizations of a country's food based on a place like that, especially when you've never actually eaten food in America.

I've actually had pizza quite a few times in Italy and have been there 3 times. There are places here that make comparable pizza, but they certainly aren't places like Domino's.
Why are you that offended? I just wrote about MY experience, what's wrong with that?

I'm not making 'broad generalizations' I'm speaking about MY experience with American pizza, which is marketed as such here by chains like Domino's. I never said 'all American pizza is such and such'.

I even started my post with 'for me', which indicates that I am speaking about my experiences alone.. Not engaging with you anymore.
 

medtran49

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If American they usually use cow's milk mozzarella, which is blander and stringier, and often mix it with another cheese, use tomato sauce and for some reason dried oregano. It can be OK at times, but I only eat it when offered. Usually has a thin solid crust.

.
Why are you that offended? I just wrote about MY experience, what's wrong with that?

I'm not making 'broad generalizations' I'm speaking about MY experience with American pizza, which is marketed as such here by chains like Domino's. I never said 'all American pizza is such and such'.

I even started my post with 'for me', which indicates that I am speaking about my experiences alone.. Not engaging with you anymore.
There you go, you are implying you ate American pizza, which you haven't, and that it isn't good, only eaten if it's free. BTW, I wouldn't eat Domino's even if it was free! You didn't state it was Domino's in your original post, much less that it was Domino's in the Netherlands. You made a negative broad-sweeping generalized statement without giving all the facts.

How would you feel if I ate at a Domino's type (cheap, bottom of the pool) Netherlands chain restaurant here in the U.S. and then came on here writing that they use incorrect/inferior ingredients and that I'd only eat it if it was free? And, you don't need to engage with me by answering, I think everyone knows what your answer would be, as well as their own if they were asked the same question.
 
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TastyReuben

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@Windigo - Dominos is fine for what it is, the McDonalds of pizza, and sometimes, that's exactly what hits the spot, but it's so far off of what I would consider indicative of American pizza, that it never occurred to me, reading the earlier post, that you were taking about a global fast-food pizza chain.

No worries, though, now that I know what you're using as a measuring stick. Please bear in mind, too, that even in the US, with lots of national chain pizza places (Pizza Hut, Papa John's, Little Caesar's, Donato's, and too many others) Dominos is considered the worst of a bad bunch. It's frequently the butt of jokes here ("Dominos: The box tastes better than the pizza" :) ), even their own ads occasionally address their reputation for extremely low quality.

Usually, if you're talking to an American who is food-oriented about pizza, they're probably going to make the assumption that you mean pizza from more traditional pizzerias, not the chain places. I certainly did. The chain places aren't really even in my consciousness unless someone mentions them by name.

I will agree, though, that the majority of pizza places (even the artisanal ones) use cow's milk mozzarella, although buffalo mozzarella is certainly not uncommon (I can even buy it at a nearby grocer's) and it's easy enough to get on a pizza here.

Pizza styles are so varied here, it's not even possible to have one "American" pizza style. I can name about a dozen distinct American pizza styles off the top of my head, and I'm likely missing another 10.

One day, if you ever come to little ol' Cincinnati Ohio, I'll take you to Adriatico's, or Fireside, or better yet, make you one at the house! I'll even use imported tomatoes and buffalo mozzarella! :)
 

CraigC

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Some where around the turn of the 20th century Italian immigrants brought their "pizza" with them, but it pretty much remained within that community. It wasn't until after WWII, with returning military that had been stationed in Italy, that pizza gained popularity in the US. The chain pizza places pretty much ruined pizza for us. It wasn't until folks started going to actual maw and paw places that good pizza was discovered. I personally prefer pizza made at home or from places with wood burning ovens.
 

TastyReuben

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One of my favorite real-life Dominos jokes, from an office break room discussion a few years ago:

Dave: Morning, Tracey. Have a good weeeknd?

Tracey: Yeah, it was! It was the twins' birthday, so we had a pizza party, ordered from Dominos.

Dave: You hate your kids that much, huh?

:laugh::laugh::laugh:
 

Windigo

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@Windigo - Dominos is fine for what it is, the McDonalds of pizza, and sometimes, that's exactly what hits the spot, but it's so far off of what I would consider indicative of American pizza, that it never occurred to me, reading the earlier post, that you were taking about a global fast-food pizza chain.

No worries, though, now that I know what you're using as a measuring stick. Please bear in mind, too, that even in the US, with lots of national chain pizza places (Pizza Hut, Papa John's, Little Caesar's, Donato's, and too many others) Dominos is considered the worst of a bad bunch. It's frequently the butt of jokes here ("Dominos: The box tastes better than the pizza" :) ), even their own ads occasionally address their reputation for extremely low quality.

Usually, if you're talking to an American who is food-oriented about pizza, they're probably going to make the assumption that you mean pizza from more traditional pizzerias, not the chain places. I certainly did. The chain places aren't really even in my consciousness unless someone mentions them by name.

I will agree, though, that the majority of pizza places (even the artisanal ones) use cow's milk mozzarella, although buffalo mozzarella is certainly not uncommon (I can even buy it at a nearby grocer's) and it's easy enough to get on a pizza here.

Pizza styles are so varied here, it's not even possible to have one "American" pizza style. I can name about a dozen distinct American pizza styles off the top of my head, and I'm likely missing another 10.

One day, if you ever come to little ol' Cincinnati Ohio, I'll take you to Adriatico's, or Fireside, or better yet, make you one at the house! I'll even use imported tomatoes and buffalo mozzarella! :)
Thanks for taking the time to explain, I might've been better off if I used the word 'American style pizza' but the way I said it is just how this kind of pizza is referenced where I live. Domino's is actually not that bad around here if you can accept the lesser quality cheese, there are many worse places which I think is down to EU quality standards.

Can you tell me what a traditional American pizza is like then? I'm curious now :laugh:
 
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