Restaurants and vegan options

As rocklobster said, there's this weird trend, that everything has to be fit to personal preferences. Like when Nike started to sell self designed shoes, with "unique" colors that you can individually choose some people expect you to serve everything to their personal taste.

Most restaurants don't work this way, you go there with your friends or alone and choose from the menu, that you can usually look up in the internet.
modern chefs should be able to work something out for dietary needs like lactose intolerance, celiac disease and veganism. That's why many tend to serve three different side dishes, like fries, some puree and noddles/Risotto. My previous chefs always included at least one vegan option for starter, main and dessert.
But IMO a bbq house doesn't need to serve tofu or something fancy, their grilled vegetables are enough for a vegan friend
 
The OMWC said:
Absolutely true. But at the same time, I think it reflects poorly on the quality of a chef if he or she can't deal with something simple and (increasingly) common. Their choice to look bad.
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And that is your right to feel that way....but, truthfully, the only people who feel this way are the people who wanted something specific..98% of the diners left happy...
People shouldn't expect to get an oil change at a tire shop, listen to Garth Brooks at a jazz club, or get a hamburger at Subway..I look at it the same way..specific diets would be better served to go to specific restaurants that cater to that.
It's unfortunate, I agree, but reality none the less..

And, finally, if you wanted to go to a place that has a good reputation and a chef who cooks predominantly with meat and meat by products, you can be sure any vegan or vegetarian menu item is an add-on after thought that they have there for business reasons and it probably isn't his/her strength..:cook:
As a meat eater, if I wanted a selection of non meat entrees I would go to a vegetarian restaurant. That's what they do best.
 
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Rocklobster said:
People shouldn't expect to get an oil change at a tire shop, listen to Garth Brooks at a jazz club, or get a hamburger at Subway..I look at it the same way..specific diets would be better served to go to specific restaurants that cater to that.
It's unfortunate, I agree, but reality none the less..
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Great analogy. I wouldn't go to a vegan restaurant and ask the chef to prepare me an off-menu dish with meat. I wouldn't even call ahead to arrange that.

CD
 
PabloLerntKochen said:
As rocklobster said, there's this weird trend, that everything has to be fit to personal preferences. Like when Nike started to sell self designed shoes, with "unique" colors that you can individually choose some people expect you to serve everything to their personal taste.

Most restaurants don't work this way, you go there with your friends or alone and choose from the menu, that you can usually look up in the internet.
modern chefs should be able to work something out for dietary needs like lactose intolerance, celiac disease and veganism. That's why many tend to serve three different side dishes, like fries, some puree and noddles/Risotto. My previous chefs always included at least one vegan option for starter, main and dessert.
But IMO a bbq house doesn't need to serve tofu or something fancy, their grilled vegetables are enough for a vegan friend
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How about people who are just picky eaters? I often ask for a substitution for side dishes or to leave something off. Like a salad that comes with Bleu cheese, I'll ask for a different (almost any other) cheese. Or regular fries instead of sweet potato fries because I don't like sweet potatoes. I'll never ask for a menu item that's not listed, but it shouldn't be too hard to swap something out. However, that often gets messed up when I'm dining out. The server says "sure, no problem" and my requests aren't granted when the food is served.
 
JAS_OH1 said:
How about people who are just picky eaters? I often ask for a substitution for side dishes or to leave something off. Like a salad that comes with Bleu cheese, I'll ask for a different (almost any other) cheese. Or regular fries instead of sweet potato fries because I don't like sweet potatoes. I'll never ask for a menu item that's not listed, but it shouldn't be too hard to swap something out. However, that often gets messed up when I'm dining out. The server says "sure, no problem" and my requests aren't granted when the food is served.
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Now you’re talking modifications. That’s a whole other kettle of fish. I’ll address this later. I’m busy making two wraps. One, hold the sauce and another no tomatoes .

Now, you’ve got me started. Dear God, I hope this doesn’t get ugly. 🤪
 
Rocklobster said:
Now you’re talking modifications. That’s a whole other kettle of fish. I’ll address this later. I’m busy making two wraps. One, hold the sauce and another no tomatoes .

Now, you’ve got me started. Dear God, I hope this doesn’t get ugly. 🤪
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Yeah, it is a different thing to ask for a substitute or small modification. As long as the substitution is something on your menu somewhere, at least you have it. And, even fast food shops will generally allow you to "hold the onions" or stuff like that.

CD
 
Rocklobster said:
Now you’re talking modifications. That’s a whole other kettle of fish. I’ll address this later. I’m busy making two wraps. One, hold the sauce and another no tomatoes .

Now, you’ve got me started. Dear God, I hope this doesn’t get ugly. 🤪
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I don't think you are capable of being mean. You are much too polite. At any rate, discussions don't have to get ugly.
 
JAS_OH1 said:
I don't think you are capable of being mean. You are much too polite. At any rate, discussions don't have to get ugly.
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Of course. I was just having fun with you. And making lite of the frustrations in this business.
I come from the other side of the tracks where calling somebody a four letter word is a term of endearment so I have to be careful how I talk to people. Winona doesn’t let me out of the kitchen to mingle with the public very often.
 
Dammit, I wrote a nice long reply and the BB won't let me post it. Grrrrr. So you'll have to guess which posts I'm responding to.

I was given orders to never cross the line to FOH or ever talk to customers.:D

Vegetarian restaurants are inevitably awful. I think I've been to perhaps two Chinese vegetarian places where the food was actually good; all of the other ones ranged from mediocre-but-expensive to dreadful. All of my best meals have been at places that don't cater to vegetarians but have good chefs who source good ingredients and cook for flavor rather than philosophy. My dinner last weekend at a Georgian place in NYC was a perfect example, absolutely brilliant and creative food.

I did check the menu at the Aussie place- from the item descriptions, it's easy to see what things they have on hand to do vegetarian dishes. And if the chef could have bothered, there was plenty to work with. For this specific incident, he's doubly to blame because the vegans were assured they'd be taken care of and he didn't bother to communicate with his staff so that this could have been done properly.

That said, it is an unfortunate fact of life that group choices (especially work-related) cause vegetarians/vegans to go to places that they would not choose. I know that if I'm being dragged to Ruth's Chris, I better grab a slice of pizza on the way, I'll be subsisting on a Diet Coke at dinner.
 
Rocklobster said:
Now you’re talking modifications. That’s a whole other kettle of fish. I’ll address this later. I’m busy making two wraps. One, hold the sauce and another no tomatoes .

Now, you’ve got me started. Dear God, I hope this doesn’t get ugly. 🤪
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Your muscle memory is trained since months or perhaps longer to always repeat the exact same way how to prepare the dish and then there're customers who want you to change something and still be as fast as if you would prepare the dish regularly.
 
Sounds to me like Chef Mountain managed that one really badly, especially if the client phoned in advance. If I'd been the chef, I'd at least have made an effort to accommodate.
However, a restaurant is a business, often depending on very tight profit margins, and is there to provide food and service for a majority. Vegans represent less than 1% of the world population, although in Australia, it's around 6%. A restaurant menu is limited, so there'll be items on the menu which primarily cater for the majority, which means omnivores. Like it or not, that's a hard financial fact. You have to sell as many dishes as possible to survive. IF there are any vegetarian or vegan options, they're obviously going to be limited, unfortunately.
 
PabloLerntKochen said:
Your muscle memory is trained since months or perhaps longer to always repeat the exact same way how to prepare the dish and then there're customers who want you to change something and still be as fast as if you would prepare the dish regularly.
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Right..A kitchen is essentially a factory. The creative part is done after hours, at home or meetings, with designers for menu and dining room..
But, when it is service time it is pretty technical. Everything is best done exactly the same, every time to ensure consistency and good timing. The menu items are designed to be presented and eaten in a way that requires all ingredients to be included the way it was intended. Once you introduce any changes, (mods) that interrupts the flow of the assembly line. Most places can, and will accommodate some easier changes, but can't properly function if the requests are too complicated. So, every place has to have a limit, or policy, to ensure that the rhythm of the kitchen remains fluid and doesn't bog down or get back up. There is not a bunch of good looking hipsters back there sprinkling parsley on everything..lol.

If I can be frank, personally, I have come to hate mods and special requests. I will try to accommodate most of them, but we get some doozies...
Sorry. We're not talking about vegans any more..
 
The OMWC said:
That said, it is an unfortunate fact of life that group choices (especially work-related) cause vegetarians/vegans to go to places that they would not choose. I know that if I'm being dragged to Ruth's Chris, I better grab a slice of pizza on the way, I'll be subsisting on a Diet Coke at dinner.
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I lost count of the number of times I had to go with family/friends to Sushi bars. Of course, the worst is when they all want to go to Outback Steakhouse. Now, I love steak, but what they serve as steak at Outhouse is NOT steak. You need a saw to cut it.

I am available to be "dragged" to Ruth's Chris any time. :okay:

CD
 
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